♪ ♪ >>COMING UP NEXT ON "IVORY TOWER" THE LONGEST GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN IN HISTORY, IS IT WORTH IT?

ALSO WHAT'S THE PAYOFF OF THE LARGEST EVER PROTEST?

AND, CAN ROBOTS DELIVER HEALTH CARE.

STAY TUNED FOR ANSWERS WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> THIS PROGRAM IS BROUGHT TO YOU BY THE MEMBERS OF WCNY.

THANK YOU.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO "IVORY TOWER."

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

I'M NINA MOORE OF COLGATE UNIVERSITY.

THE PROFESSORS AROUND THE TABLE TONIGHT ARE TARA ROSS OF ONONDAGA COMMUNITY COLLEGE, RICK FENNER OF UTICA UNIVERSITY CHAD SPARBER OF COLGATE UNIVERSITY, AND ANIRBAN ACHRYA OF LEMOYNE COLLEGE.

THE LONGEST GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN IN AMERICAN HISTORY CONTINUES SO DO THE COSTS BORNE BY TSA AGENTS WHO WENT A MONTH AND A HALF WITHOUT PAY.

SOME FACED EVICTION FROM THEIR HOMES REPOSSESSION OF THEIR CARS AND EVEN HAVING TO DONATE BLOOD FOR MONEY THIS IS ALL BECAUSE DEMOCRATS ARE DEMANDING MAJOR REFORMS TO IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS ENFORCEMENT.

AS A CONDITION FOR REOPENING THE GOVERNMENT.

THE QUESTION WE WANNA DIG INTO TONIGHT IS IT ALL WORTH IT?

DOES THE STANDOFF OVER ICE REFORM JUSTIFY THE HARDSHIP ON TSA AGENTS?

>> FIRST, A LITTLE PUSHBACK HERE.

I DON'T AGREE THAT THIS IS PRIMARILY THE FAULT OF DEMOCRATS.

IT'S TRUE THE DEMOCRATS HAVE REFUSED TO FULLY FUND THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY.

THEY HAVE BEEN TRYING TOE USE THE POWER OF THE PURSE TO BRING ABOUT SOME CHANGES THAT THEY, AND MANY AMERICANS, THINK NEED TO BE PUT INTO PLACE.

AND SO THEY BEAR SOME RESPONSIBILITY.

BUT LET'S LOOK AT WHAT THE REPUBLICANS, THEIR ROLE HERE.

TRUMP HAS SAID THAT HE IS NOW GOING TO BE PAYING TSA OFFICIALS.

HE HAS HAD THIS MONEY ALL ALONG.

SO SHE COULD HAVE AVOIDED THIS PROBLEM FROM THE START.

SECOND, THE DEMOCRATS HAVE OFFERED A NUMBER OF COMPROMISES THAT THE REPUBLICANS HAVE REJECTED; ONE OF WHICH LOOKED LIKE IT WAS GOING TO COME THROUGH AND THERE WAS BIPARTISAN SUPPORT IN THE SENATE, BUT THE HOUSE REJECTED IT.

AND THAT WOULD HAVE FUNDED THE D.H.S.

WITHOUT MONEY GOING FOR ICE.

AND THIS WOULD HAVE NO IMPACT ON USES LAWS BAST YEAR CONGRESS PUT IN A SLUSH FUND IF YOU WILL OF SO IS THIS IN FACT A DEMOCRATIC SHUTDOWN OR NOT?

>> I DON'T THINK THAT THE FINGER POINTING ACTUALLY IS CONSTRUCTIVE OR AT ALL.

I MEAN A LITTLE BIT MORE INSTRUCTIVE IS TO THINK ABOUT WHAT OR WHY THE TRUMP ERA SHUTDOWNS HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT FROM THE EARLIER ONES.

IT'S BECAUSE ELECTED POLICYMAKERS, THEY WORRY MORE ABOUT THEIR HARD CORE BASE THAN APPEALING TO THE CENTRIST VOTER.

THAT'S A PROBLEM WITH GERRYMANDERING, WHICH HELPS EXPLAIN WHY THE HOUSE HAS BEEN UNWILLING TO COMPROMISE IN THE WAYS THAT THE SENATE HAS: THAT'S A PROBLEM THAT IS NOT GOING AWAY.

THE SOLUTIONS TO IT, I THINK, THERE IS THIS HARVARD KENNEDY SCHOOL PROFESSOR, WHO ARGUES ONE WAY TO PREVENT SHUTDOWNS WOULD BE TO GIVE BUDGET COMMITTEES MORE POWER BECAUSE RIGHT NOW THEY'RE FILLED WITH JUNIOR MEMBERS, THEY HAVE TERM LIMITS.

THEY DON'T HAVE THE POWER TO ENFORCE ANYTHING.

BUT THOSE ARE LIKE POLITICAL SCIENCE QUESTIONS AND I'M SO FAR OUT OF MY DEPTH THERE.

IT'S LIKE OH I THINK THAT'S AN INTERESTING WAY TO THINK ABOUT HOW DO WE MOVE FORWARD FROM THIS TERRIBLE EEK LIB JUMP WE ARE IN WHERE IT'S LEFT, RIGHT, YOUR FAULT, YOUR FAULT.

>> SO WHAT IS THE ANSWER.

>> COMING DOWN TO THE POLITICAL SCIENCE ALLEY HERE, THAT IS RIGHT THAT AS WE HAVE SEEN MORE POLARIZATION IN THE U.S.

SOCIETY SOCIETY, THE IDEA OF THE MEDIAN VOTER HAS SLOWLY EVAPORATING.

WE WILL HAVE CONSOLIDATED BASE THAT ARE POLARIZED.

NOW YOU KNOW WHEN WE TEACH AMERICAN PRESIDENCY AND WE TALK ABOUT THE POTUS AS A PERSUADER, GREAT NEGOTIATOR MUCH REAGAN BEING ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE, HE HAD A LOT 6 DIFFERENCES WITH THE CONGRESS, BUT HE SOMEHOW CAME OR WAS ABLE AND LYNDON JOHNSON BEING ONE OF THOSE, RIGHT.

I SEE HERE TRUMP HAS A POSITION AND IS GOING TO ENTRENCH HIS POSITION AND DOUBLE DOWN ON THAT AND THAT DRAWS THE TRENCH LINES FROM WHICH YOU CANNOT EXTRICATE YOURSELF.

LOOK, WHY ARE WE HERE.

TWO U.S.

CITIZENS WERE KILLED AND THE ADMINISTRATION STARTED SAYING WITHOUT EVIDENCE THEY'RE DOMESTIC TERRORISTS AND THIS THAT AND THE OTHER.

THESE WERE JUST DECENT AMERICANS.

THEY WERE NOT HAPPY.

SO WHY SHOULD YOU HAVE MASK?

WHY CAN'T YOU SHOW YOUR NAME 1234 SHOULDN'T THERE BE A JUDICIAL WARRANT?

THESE ARE BASIC CONSTITUTIONAL DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS.

AND, YES, FINGER POINTING WON'T HELP BUT AT THE SAME TIME THESE ARE NOT REALLY BIG DEMANDS AND TRUMP, AND HIS PARTY, IF THEY WISH TO, THEY CAN OPEN THIS GOVERNMENT.

THEY'RE WILLING TO PAY FOR FEMA AND ICE AND... >> AND DO WHAT DEMOCRATS WANT.

>> ICE HAS TO BE CONTROLLED IN A CERTAIN WAY.

>> BUT IS IT SIMPLY ABOUT ICE AND THE REFORMS THAT YOU MENTIONED BECAUSE SOME DEMOCRAT LEADERS HAVE COMPLAINED THAT SHUTDOWNS ARE USED TOO OFTEN AS LEVERAGE TO FORCE POLICY CONCESSIONS.

WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT THAT?

ACTUALLY, I AGREE WITH THAT IDEA.

BUT I AGREE WITH IT IN THE SENSE THAT WHEN WE INITIALLY STARTED HAVING SHUTDOWNS, PART OF THE IDEA WAS THIS WAS SUCH, YOU KNOW, THE NOTION THAT ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES WERE SHUT, THEMSELVES SHUT DOWN THE GOVERNMENT WAS SUCH A BIG THING THAT IT GAVE A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF LEVERAGE.

WELL, THIS HAS NOW BEEN USED NUMEROUS TIMES AND WITH ANYTHING ELSE, THE MORE YOU SURVIVE IT, THE LESS YOU WORRY ABOUT IT.

AND AS HORRIBLE AS IT SOUNDS, YOU KNOW, WHEN DID WE REALLY BEGIN TO HEAR MORE AND MORE ABOUT THE FACT THAT THE TSA WAS WORKING WITHOUT PAY AND, YOU KNOW, COAST GUARD AND OTHERS WERE WORKING WITHOUT PAY?

WHEN PEOPLE STARTED TRAVELING AND THEY HAD TO WAIT FOR A LONG TIME IN TSA LINES.

AND THAT, QUITE FRANKLY, CERTAINLY WHAT THE REPUBLICANS DEPENDED ON, IS THAT MOST AMERICANS THEMSELVES WEREN'T GOING TO FEEL THE PINCH.

AND THAT'S PART OF THE REASON IT HAS BECOME LESS EFFECTIVE.

THE PROBLEM IS, AND AS I SIT HERE, I SORT OF LIKE THE IDEA THAT CHAD SUGGESTED, WHAT IS THE ALTERNATIVE FOR THE DEMOCRATS BECAUSE THEY'RE ASKING FOR SOME REAL REASONABLE REFORMS.

THEY DON'T HAVE THE VOTES TO GET IT, TO GET IT THE NORMAL WAY SO WHAT ARE THEIR OPTIONS.

>> THE REPUBLICANS HAVE CLEVERLY PULLED BACK ON THE ICE ENFORCEMENT.

THE DEMOCRATS ARE COMPLAINING ABOUT SOMETHING THAT IS NOT HAPPENING AT THE MOMENT AND LONG LINES RS.

>> GIVING MORE CONTROL TO BUDGET COMMITTEES?

CONGRESS HAS ALREADY GIVEN UP ITS POWER OVER THE PURSE TO THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION SO IF THE LEADERS OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY AREN'T GOING TO STAND UP TO HIM, HOW IS SOME, YOU KNOW, HEAD A COMMITTEE... >> THERE IS HISTORY THERE.

SO THESE SHUTDOWNS NEVER HAPPENED UNTIL 1996 WHEN I WAS A SENIOR IN HIGH SCHOOL AND IT'S ALL AN ARTIFACT THAT GOES BACK TO 1970s POLICY CHANGE TO REIN IN NIXON'S POWERS.

IT STARTED WITH CONGRESS TRYING TO TAKE MORE CONTROL BUT HAD ININTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

>> YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THE CONGRESSIONAL BUDGET AND EMPOWERMENT CONTROL ACT OF 1974.

BUT RICK, LET ME COME BACK TO YOU AND ASK.

ULTIMATELY ISN'T THIS SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE AND, IN THIS CASE HAS BEEN RESOLVED AT THE POLLS?

VOTERS VOTED FOR REPUBLICANS.

WHY ARE DEMOCRATS OBSTRUCTING?

>> BECAUSE I THINK THEY BELIEVE THAT MAJORITY OF AMERICANS THINK THAT ICE IS OVERSTEPPING.

YOU KNOW, ANIRBAN MENTIONED A NUMBER OF THINGS THAT ARE VERY COMMON SENSE.

AND SO WITHOUT THE ABILITY TO COMPROMISE, THE ONLY WAY ARE THESE REALLY NUCLEAR, YOU KNOW, OPTIONS, WHICH IS SHUTTING DOWN THE GOVERNMENT.

BUT, BY THE WAY, GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN MISNOMER HERE.

THIS IS A VERY PARTIAL SHUTDOWN OF A PART OF A DEPARTMENT BECAUSE MUCH OF D.H.S.

IS STILL BEING FUNDED, AS I SAID, BECAUSE OF THE 2025 LEGISLATION THAT HAS AN $80 BILLION SLUSH FUND FOR THAT DEPARTMENT TO CONTINUE TO FUNCTION EXCEPT FOR TSA AND A COUPLE OF OTHER... >> TSA, FEMA AND CYBERSECURITY.

SO ANIRBAN, IS THIS REALLY THE RIGHT TIME TO HAVE EVEN A PARTIAL GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN, ESPECIALLY FOR F TSA AGENTS WHO KEEP THE AIR DWAI-- THE AIR WAYS SAFE.

>> I HEAR ABOUT THE TSA AGENTS NOT ABLE TO DRIVE TO WORK, MISSING PAYCHECKS.

THESE ARE NOT RICH PEOPLE HERE AND IT'S A VERY DIFFICULT JOB.

OF COURSE THE DEMOCRATS SHOULD MESSAGE IN A CERTAIN WAY THROUGH LIKE, THAT WE HAVE NOTHING AGAINST THE TSA.

WHAT WE HAVE IS, YOU KNOW AGAINST THE IDEA THAT YOU ARE BEING SO HEAD STRONG IN NOT HAVING TO-- NOT COMPROMISING AT ALL.

THE QUESTION IS, REPUBLICANS IN SOME WAY OWN CONGRESS, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE VOTED FOR DEMOCRATS, TOO.

AND THEY WANT TO SEE DEMOCRATS DO SOMETHING IN ORDER TO PROTECT AMERICANS FROM BEING JUST NABBED FROM THE STREETS AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.

>> SOMETHING THAT ACTUALLY GETS WHAT DEMOCRAT VOTERS WANT, RIGHT?

THIS YEAR'S ‘NO KINGS' PROTEST WAS THE LARGEST SINGLE PROTEST IN AMERICAN HISTORY DRAWING AN ESTIMATED 8 MILLION PARTICIPANTS FROM ACROSS THE COUNTRY IN ALL 50 STATES AND RIGHT HERE IN DEWITT, NEW YORK WHERE SEVERAL THOUSAND PROTESTORS RALLIED ALONG ERIE BOULEVARD THE HISTORIC TURNOUT WAS BOLSTERED BY HIGH-PROFILE CELEBRITIES WHO SPOKE OR PERFORMED AT SOME OF THE EVENTS BUT, SO WHAT?

HAVE THESE PROTESTS MADE A DIFFERENCE?

WHAT IMPACT, IF ANY, HAVE THEY HAD?

PERHAPS WE SHOULD START WITH THE QUESTION OF EXACTLY WHAT ARE THEY INTENDED TO ACCOMPLISH?

>> WELL, FIRST AND FOREMOST, THE GOALS OF THE PROTESTS ARE TO SHOW PUBLIC ANGER OVER ACTIONS BY THE PRESIDENT, WHICH, TO THE PUBLIC PERCEPTION, OF THOSE CERTAINLY WHO WERE PROTESTING AND MANY OTHERS ARE KING-LIKE.

IN OTHER WORDS, WE HAVE A SYSTEM OF LAWS.

WE HAVE LAWS THAT HAVE BEEN PASSED BY DULY ELECTED OFFICIALS OVER THE YEARS, AND THIS PRESIDENT, BASICALLY SEEMS TO FLOUT THEM AND IGNORE THEM.

AND HE SEEMS TO IGNORE, YOU KNOW, EVEN SUPREME COURT DECISIONS SAYING THIS IS THE LAW.

THIS IS WHAT YOU SHOULD BE FOLLOWING.

SO MANY AMERICANS HAVE JOINED THESE PROTESTS-- AND PARTS OF WHY YOU HAD THIS LAST ONE BEING THE LARGEST IN HISTORY-- HAVE JOINED THE PROTESTS BECAUSE THEY FEEL THERE IS NO OTHER WAY TO GET THE MESSAGE ACROSS TO THE PRESIDENT AND MORE IMPORTANTLY BECAUSE I THINK MOST PEOPLE RECOGNIZE THE PRESIDENT IS NOT GOING TO CHANGE FROM WHO HE IS AND WHAT HE THINKS.

THIS IS TO TELL CONGRESS WE DON'T LIKE THE FACT THAT, IN ESSENCE, YOU ARE NOT DOING YOUR JOB.

YOU ARE NOT REINING HIM IN.

WE JUST TALKED ABOUT THE FAILURE TO RAIN REIN.

IN THAT'S THE GOAL OF THE PROTESTS.

IT'S ALSO, I THINK, TO GIVE MANY PEOPLE-- AND THIS IS GOING TO SOUND A LITTLE WEIRD CONSIDERING HOW PUBLIC THESE PROTESTS ARE-- BUT TO GIVE THEM A WAY TO SHOW THAT DISPLEASURE BECAUSE WHEN YOU WRITE YOUR CONGRESS PERSON, YOU AUTOMATICALLY ARE ON SOME SORT OF LIST WHETHER IT'S FOR THEM TO SEND YOU FUNDRAISING MATERIALS OR WHAT HAVE YOU.

BUT WHEN YOU ARE IN THIS PROTEST, WHILE YOU MIGHT BE SEEN ON CAMERA, SOMEONE HAS TO TAKE THE TIME TO IDENTIFY WHO YOU ARE, ET CETERA.

WHEREAS WITH THIS, YOU ARE JOINED WITH OTHER PEOPLE.

IT REINFORCES-- >> EIGHT MILLION.

>> IT REINFORCE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT THINKING WRONG, ET CETERA.

>> CAN I COME TO YOU, ANIRBAN AND ASK THIS QI.

I WANT TO UNPACK A LITTLE BIT MORE WHAT THE STATED GOES ARE WHEN YOU GO TO THE WEBSITE.

THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT MASKED SECRET POLICING.

CATASTROPHIC WAR, DRIVING UP THE COST OF LIVING, FREEDOM TO VOTE, THE COST OF LIVING.

IT'S ALL OVER THE PLACE, NO?

>> YEAH, I MEAN, LOOK.

A COUPLE OF THINGS HERE.

A VERY IMPORTANT TRADITION OF SOCIAL MOVEMENT THEY'RE NECESSITY AMERICAN POLITICS.

THE SOCIAL MOVEMENTS LEAD TO REAL SOCIETAL CHANGE IN AMERICAN POLITICS OTHER THAN POLARRISM AND OTHER COMPETING THEORIES.

I ALSO THINK PROTEST IS A GOOD THING, THE GREAT THING ABOUT THE UNITED STATES IS THAT WE USE THOSE EXERCISE THOSE RIGHTS LIKE A MUSCLE.

IF YOU DON'T USE A MUSCLE, IT ATROPHIES.

IF YOU DON'T USE AND SAFEGUARDS OUR RIGHTS VIGILANTLY, RIGHT OR LEFT I DON'T CARE, WE STAND TO LOSE YOUR DEMOCRATIC CULTURE AND HERITAGE.

HAVING SAID THAT, I THINK DEMOCRATS ARE TOO MUCH CONCENTRATED HERE, VERY DEMOCRATIC PARTISAN KIND OF A PROTEST FOCUSED TOO MUCH ON TRUMP.

BUT YOU KNOW, THE ACTUAL THING IS, FROM 1776, THE CONGRESS, WHICH IS THE BIGGEST BODY WHICH IS SUPPOSED TO BE THE MOST IMPORTANT BODY-- EARLIER PRESIDENTS WANTED THE CONGRESS TO BE A CLERK OF CONGRESS.

WE HAVE EXPANDED THAT POWER ACROSS SEVERAL ADMINISTRATIONS.

>> STARTING WITH F.D.R.

>> I NEVER SAW ANYBODY PROTEST WHEN PRESIDENT OBAMA WAS DOING KILLINGS IN AFGHANISTAN.

>> TRUMP IS A CERTAIN KIND OF A CHARACTER THAT PUTS OFF PEOPLE, BUT TRADITION OF THIS IMPERIAL IST PRESIDENCY TAKING MORE AND MORE POWER, THAT HAS HAPPENED FOR A VERY LONG TIME THROUGHOUT THE ADMINISTRATIONS.

THAT'S WHAT WE SHOULD PROTEST.

>> RICK, THE REAL GOAL IS NOT ANY SPECIFIC POLICY.

IT'S GALVANIZING AND EXTENDING THE BASE AHEAD OF THE MID TERM ELECTIONS AND THE NEXT PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.

YOU KNOW, IF I WRITE A LETTER TO THE EDITOR, YOU KNOW, IT'S EASY TO DISCOUNT FENNER IS JUST A CRANK.

BUT WHEN HAVE YOU EIGHT MILLION PEOPLE OUT ON THE STREETS, MULTIPLE TIMES AND AS THE CROWDS GROW BIGGER THE MORE WE DO, THIS I THINK IT'S A WAY OF NOT ONLY, YOU KNOW, BRINGING PEOPLE TOGETHER AND SHOWING THEY'RE EVEN HAVING THESE IN VERY RED DISTRICTS TO SHOW THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK TURNOUT IS GOING TO BE A BIG ISSUE IN THE ELECTIONS.

SO SHOWING PEOPLE THAT THERE IS SOLIDARITY HERE AND BY BEING VERY BROAD, THEY'RE ABLE TO BRING IN PEOPLE WHO, YOU KNOW, MIGHT NOT DISAGREE WITH EVERYTHING THAT TRUMP IS DOING SUGGEST BETTER THINGS.

I THINK THIS IS A WISE MOVE.

THEY'RE ALSO USING THIS TO GATHER INFORMATION.

THEY HAVE DATABASES.

THEY KNOW THIS IS NOT THE END ALL.

THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DO A NUMBER OF OTHER THINGS.

I THINK THIS IS A VERY GOOD STRATEGY AND IT SORT OF IS THE EQUIVALENT OF INDIVIDUALS PUTTING TRUMP FLAGS OUT ON THEIR FRONT LAWN, WHICH YOU SEE A FAIR NUMBER OF THEM, AT LEAST WHERE I LIVE.

AND THIS IS A COUNTER ACTION TO THAT.

>> AND THEN HAVING LIKE THE BOSS HIMSELF, BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN JOIN AND ROBERT DEANYWHERE DENIRO AND MANY OTHERS AND I CAN SEE YOU CHOMPING-- >> THIS IS RECOMMENDNESS ENT-- REMINISCENT OF THE ECONOMIC BLACKOUT OF 1885.

CALLING FOR A BOYCOTT OF FIRMS THAT PULLED BACK THEIR DEI POLICIES AND PROTEST RISING PRICES OF FOOD AT THE SAME TIME AND ALSO THE FIRING OF FEDERAL WORKERS AND IT WAS SO INFURIATING BECAUSE THE DEMOCRATS CANNOT FOCUS ON A SINGLE ISSUE.

AND SO YOU HAVE THE SAME THING HAPPENING HERE.

IF THIS WERE ALL ABOUT AUTONOMY, I WOULD BE TOTALLY ON BOARD BUT YOU GO TO THE WEBSITE LIKE NINA MENTIONED, IT LISTS A LAUNDRY LIST OF THINGS THAT ALSO INCLUDES AMERICA HAS A LONG HISTORY ROOTED IN WHITE SUPREMACY.

I'M SORRY.

THAT'S UNNECESSARILY ALIENATING.

I'M OUT.

IT IS NOT TRYING TO BUILD A BROAD-BASED COALITION.

BOYCOTTS ARE MORE EFFECTIVE LIKE THE ONES LAST FEBRUARY, WHEN THEY FOCUSED ON TESLA, OKAY?

AND THESE NO KINGS PROTESTS, THEY WOULD BE MORE EFFECTIVE IF THEY FOCUSED AS WELL, PARTICULARLY ON THE OUGHT TRAITIC-- AUTOCRATIC THINGS WE ARE DANCING AROUND LIKE TRUMP HAS TOO MUCH EXECUTIVE POWER.

DO YOU THAT AND YOU GET JOE ROGUE AN AND ALL OF HIS, WHAT DO YOU CALL THEM,-- THEY'RE LIKE ANGRY ABOUT THE WAR.

THEY'RE ANGRY ABOUT ICE AGENTS AND THE MASKS AND CIVIL LIBERTIES VIOLATIONS.

>> THOSE ARE STILL PART OF THIS.

>> BUT DO YOU THINK THOSE PEOPLE ARE ON BOARD WITH SIGNS THAT SAY OVERTHROW THE PATRIARCHY OR THAT AMERICA IS A RACIST NATION?

NO, THEY'RE NOT.

AND SO NO KINGS IS INEFFECTIVE.

>> SO YOUR POINT IS THAT IT SHOULD BE MORE FOCUSED.

I WANT TO CLARIFY YOU ARE NOT AGAINST BEING AGAINST WHITE SUPREMACY.

>> NO.

>> OKAY.

SO TO TAKE CHAD'S POINT AS THE JUMPING OFF POINT HERE, TARA.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT PREVIOUS PROTESTS, HISTORIC PROTESTS THAT WERE EFFECTIVE, THEY WERE VERY FOCUSED.

THE WOMEN'S RIGHTS MOVEMENT, NATIVE AMERICAN MOVEMENT, CRIMINAL RIGHTS MOVEMENT AND CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT, BY THEIR NAMES WE KNEW WHAT THEY WERE ABOUT.

DO YOU AGREE THAT THIS NEEDS MORE FOCUS?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

SAYING NO KINGS ASSUMES YOU UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A KING AND THE AMERICAN PRESIDENT.

BEING HONEST, A GOOD MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE OUT THERE PROTESTING, YOU KNOW, THEY SORT OF KIND OF KNOW THE DIFFERENCE, BUT THEY DON'T REALLY.

SO I ABSOLUTELY THINK THEY DO NEED TO PICK MAYBE AND MORE.

WELL, SECRETARY OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES ROBERT KENNEDY BELIEVES THAT THINGS LIKE LACK SAMPLES AND PRESCRIPTION CAN BE DELIVERED, ROBOTS CAN GIVE ULTRASOUNDS TO WOMEN AND A.I.

AVATARS CAN HELP FILL IN OTHER GAPS.

CHAD, ON THE SURFACE IT FEES LIKE THE JETSONS BUT IT IS SOMETHING, RIGHT?

SOMETHING TO HELP WITH THE CRISIS IN RURAL HEALTHCARE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

>> IT IS.

AND I THINK THE KEY QUOTE, I GUESS FROM Dr.

OZ IS THAT THE PURPOSE OF THIS FUND IS NOT TO PAY OPERATING EXPENSES.

IT'S TO DEAL WITH THE FUNDAMENTAL HINDERANCES OF IMPROVEMENT IN RURAL HEALTHCARE.

AND SO LIKE I KIND OF INTERPRET THIS AS IF YOU SEE THIS AS KIND OF A STOP GAP TO MEDICARE OR MEDICAID KITS, IT'S ABOUT USING RURAL COMMUNITIES AS LABORATORIES TO SEE WHAT NEW TECHNOLOGIES WILL BE EFFECTIVE IN THE FUTURE.

IN SOME WAYS IT'S EXCITING TO FIND OUT LIKE WHAT IS GOING TO BE EFFECTIVE?

SOME OF THE THINGS YOU MENTIONED, LIKE THESE DRONE DELIVERIES AND EXPANDED TELEMEDICINE AND USING WEARABLE TECHNOLOGY TO DIAGNOSE WHAT PROBLEMS ARE.

IF YOU VIEW THIS LIKE A SUBSTITUTE FOR MEDICAID, IT'S GOING TO FALL SHORT.

BUT IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT AS LIKE A TOOL FOR TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW TO TRANSITION TOWARD THE FUTURE, IT HAS SOME POTENTIAL.

>> FOR EXPERIMENTATION FOR THE REST OF THE COUNTRY, TOO.

RICK, WHERE ARE YOU?

>> WELL, I THINK A.I.

IS A VERY VALUABLE TOOL, DEPENDING ON HOW IT IS USED.

A.I.

CAN BE USED FOR GOOD OR EVIL.

IN THIS CASE, I THINK IF IT IS USED FOR MUNDANE TASKS OR DOING A LOT OF THINGS THAT ARE MISSING FROM RURAL HEALTHCARE SETTINGS, IT MAKES SENSE.

IT DOESN'T REPLACE HUMAN INTERACTION.

I THINK IN THOSE CASES WHERE PEOPLE ARE USING A.I., EITHER AS THEIR THERAPIST OR THEIR COULD HAVE DAPTS, THAT'S WHERE A.I.

GETS INTO A PROBLEM.

IF THIS INFORMATION THAT A.I.

COLLECTS AND IS DOING IN RURAL AREAS GOES TO PEOPLE WITH EXPERTISE, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM.

IF THIS IS JUST BEING USED BY INDIVIDUALS TO DIAGNOSE THEIR OWN PROBLEMS AND COME UP WITH SOLUTIONS I THINK IT IS GOING TO FALL SHORT.

>> BUT WE ARE ALREADY USING TECHNOLOGY NOT NECESSARILY TO TEENAGE BUT TO MONITOR BLOOD PRESSURE, HEART RATE, CHOLESTEROL LEVELS.

ISN'T THIS BUILDING UPON THAT?

>> SURE.

A.I.

CAN BE USED IN EXTREMELY INTELLIGENT WAYS AND WE HAVE A COUPLE OF PROJECTS THAT ARE GOING ON, THEY'RE FINDING GREAT ADVANCEMENTS IN, FOR EXAMPLE, DIAGNOSING CERTAIN KINDS OF CANCER, ESPECIALLY BREAST CANCER WAY EARLIER THAN ANYBODY COULD HAVE DIAGNOSED, LIKE A HUMAN MIND COULD HAVE BECAUSE A.I.

CAN SEE PATTERN AND DATA THROUGH IT.

YES, I DO THINK THAT TECHNOLOGY CAN BE USED IN INTERESTING WAYS, AND BUT I ALSO THINK IT SHOULD BE-- WE SHOULD NOT FORGET THAT WE SHOULD PROVIDE REAL INCENTIVES TO DOCTORS TO GO AND WORK IN RURAL AREAS.

THERE ARE PROGRAMS WHERE YOU CAN WRITE OFF THE DEBT AND SO ON.

IT'S NOT AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE PERSONNEL.

IT'S MORE LIKE A COMPLEMENTARY THING THAT DOCTORS WILL WORK WITH A.I.

AND THINGS LIKE THAT FOR, YOU KNOW, WEARABLE THINGS AND OTHER KINDS OF DIAGNOSIS.

WITH THAT, I DO THINK THAT, YOU KNOW,-- BUT AGAIN A.I.

HALLUCINATES.

IT DOES WRONG THINGS.

YOU NEED A PERSON TO BE THERE TO UNDERSTAND WHEN IT IS HALLUCINATING, SOMEONE WHO IS ACTUALLY AN EXPERT.

>> THAT'S HOW WE GOT HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

THERE ARE DOCTOR SHORTAGES.

WHERE DOES THE MONEY COME FROM FOR GETTING PEOPLE THERE.

WE HAVE A MINUTE LEFT, TARA?

>> THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS A PROGRAM RECENT LIE AND I APOLOGIZE I DON'T REMEMBER THE NAME WHERE BASICALLY IT'S A POT OF MONEY, RURAL COMMUNITIES COULD APPLY FOR THE MONEY AND THEY CAN USE THE MONEY TO ENCOURAGE PROVIDERS TO COME TO AN AREA.

BUT THE THING OF IT IS THAT THIS MONEY DOESN'T NECESSARILY COME WITHOUT STRINGS BECAUSE PART OF WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING IS, FOR COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE RECEIVED THESE GRANTS, BASICALLY THEY HAVE BEEN TOLD, YOU KNOW, HAVE YOU TO JUMP ON BOARD WITH THE, YOU KNOW, NO SWEETS UNDER SNAP OR WITH THE PRESIDENT'S FITNESS PROGRAM, ET CETERA.

SO THERE IS A YES AND A NO.

>> IT'S TIME FOR OUR GRADE BOOKS AND WE ARE GOING TO START WITH FS AND TARA ARE YOUR F.

>> MY F GOES TO THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION FOR EXTORTING MINERAL AND DATA ARRANGEMENTS FROM AFRICAN COUNTRIES IN EXCHANGE FOR A RESTORATION IN AMERICAN HEALTHCARE FUNDING.

YOU MAY REMEMBER THAT THE USAID WAS DISMANTLED AND AFRICAN NATIONS LOST BILLIONS IN HEALTHCARE PROGRAMS OR DEALING WITH H.I.V.

AND TUBERCULOSIS TO NAME A FEW.

ACCORDING TO BOSTON UNIVERSITY, THAT ACTION HAS COST THE LIVES OF 500,000 CHILDREN AND OVER 250,000 ADULTS.

IN ORDER TO RESTORE SOME OF THE AID, THESE COUNTRIES ARE NOW BEING REQUESTED IS TO GIVE THE U.S.

GOVERNMENT EXTRACTION RIGHTS TO SOME OF THEIR MINERALS AND OR PERSONAL DATA FROM THOSE WHO DO BUSINESS IN THOSE COUNTRIES.

>> RICK.

>> MY F GOES TO DONALD TRUMP FOR HIS CONTINUED ASSAULT ON THE NATO ALLIANCE.

WEDNESDAY TRUMP AGAIN THREATENED TO PULL OUT OF NATO.

TRUMP'S HABIT OF DISPARAGING OUR FRIENDS AND ALLIES AND FAWNING OVER OUR ENEMIES IS DANGEROUS.

>> CHAD.

>> I WAS GOING TO GIVE MY F TO BUFFALO MAYOR SEAN RYAN FOR THE 25% PROPERTY TAX INCREASE BUT THE THE OBAMA FEDERALLY APPROVED JUDGE OBTAINED A LIST TO GET A LIST OF JEWS FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF PENNSYLVANIA TO INVESTIGATE ANTI-SEMITISM BUT PURE NAZI ERA PLAYBOOK.

CONGRATULATIONS.

THIS FASCISM HAS TRUMPED YOUR TAX LIST AS DREADFUL POLICIES OF THE WEEK.

>> MY F GOES TO THE ISRAELI POLICE FOR PREVENTING CATHOLIC LEADERS FROM ENTERING THE CHURCH OF HOLY SEPULCHRE ON THE HOLY CHRISTIAN HOLIDAY MASS.

SETTING OFF A WAVE OF CRITICISM TO BE PRECISE.

ALL THE SERVICES WERE ALLOWED LATER DUE TO HIGH LEVEL INTERVENTION.

SHOWING THE SPREAD OF INTOLERANCE.

>> NOW WE ARE GOING TO TURN TO GOOD NEWS STARTING WITH YOU, TARA.

>> I'M GIVING AN A TO THREE LAKE SIDE HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS I APOLOGIZE FOR THE SAYING THEIR NAMES WRONG.

FOR WINNING THE 2026 CONGRESSIONAL APP AWARD.

THESE THREE STUDENTS DESIGNED A WELLNESS APP WHICH BLENDS NEUROSCIENCE AND PRODUCTIVITY AND HELPS USERS TO MANAGE THEIR FOCUS, REST AND MENTAL HEALTH IN A BALANCED WAY.

>> RICK.

>> MY A GOES TO THE HAMILTON COLLEGE MEN'S HOCKEY TEAM.

THEY WON THE DIVISION 3 NATIONAL HOCKEY CHAMPIONSHIP BEATING HOBART 2-1 IN A THRILLING OVERTIME GAME.

HAMILTON ENDED HOBART'S 36 GAME WINNING STREAK AND KEPT THEM FROM WINNING THEIR FOURTH NATIONAL CONSECUTIVE CHAMPIONSHIP.

CONGRATULATIONS.

>> MY A GOES TO MATT CORTLAND, FOUNDER OF AN IRISH START-UP THAT USED A.I.

TO DEVELOP A GUINNESS PRICE INDEX OR GINDEX TO TRACK THE PRICE OF A PINT ACROSS A THOUSAND PUBS IN THE COUNTRY.

ST.

BRIGID ONCE SUPPLIED ENOUGH BEER TO LAST THEM THROUGH HOLY THURSDAY TO EASTER.

HAPPY EASTER.

>> TO POPE LEO FOR ATIRP FIRMING THAT GOD DOES NOT LISTEN TO THE PRAYERS OF THOSE WHO MAKE WAR OR SIDE GOD TO JUSTIFY VIOLENCE AS HE PRAYED FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE MIDDLE EAST DURING THE PALM SUNDAY MASS.

>> THAT'S ALL WE HAVE FOR YOU TONIGHT IN THE STUDIO.

WE'D LOVE TO HEAR WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT THE TOPICS WE'VE DISCUSSED TONIGHT PLEASE WRITE TO THE ADDRESS ON YOUR SCREEN IF YOU WANT TO WATCH THE SHOW AGAIN OR SHARE IT WITH SOMEONE ELSE GO TO WCNY.ORG I'M NINA MOORE FOR ALL OF US HERE AT "IVORY TOWER" HAPPY EAST EAR AND HEAVY PASSOVER.

GOOD NIGHT.

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