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>>> FOR A INAUGURATION GEORGE WASHINGTN FAMOUSLY LABELED THE GREATEST PERFECT THIS DEMOCRACY THE UNITED STATES HAS AT TIMES STRUGGLED WITH THE NOTION OF UNIVERSAL SUFFRAGE.

OUR CONSTITUTION ORIGINALLY LIMITED VOTING TO WHILE MALES OVER THE AGE OF 21.

THE VOTE WAS WITHHELD FROM AFRICAN-AMERICANS UNTIL THE CIVIL WAR AND FRONT LINE WOMEN UNTIL THE 19TH AMENDMENT IN 1920.

UNTIL THE PASSAGE OF THE VOTE RIGHTS ACT OF 1965 SOME AMERICANS CONTINUED TO CONFRONT BALLOT BOX BARRIERS IN IF FORM OF JIM CROW, SUCH AS POLL TAXES AND LITERACY TESTS.

HI I'M JON SCHWANTES AND ON THIS WEEK'S SHOW WE EXAMINE VOTING PARTICULARLY IN THE HOOSIER STATE.

INDIANA LAWMAKERS, FROM THE STATEHOUSE TO YOUR HOUSE.

IS IT.

>>> SOME VOTING RIGHTS ACTIVISTS CONTEND THAT REPUBLICAN COMMED LEGISLATURES HERE AND ACROSS THE COUNTRY ARE HELL BENT ON ERECTING ELECTORAL HURDLES ESPECIALLY FROM DEMOCRATIC LEANING CONSTITUENCIES SUCH AS YOUNG PEOPLE AND HOURLY WORKERS WITH IN FLEXIBLE SCHEDULES IS THAT DISCOURAGE IN PERSON VOTING.

OTHERS ARGUE THAT UNCHECKED ELECTION FRAUD POSES AN EXISTENTIAL THREAT.

THE STRINGENT SAFEGUARDS THEY SAY ARE ESSENTIAL BECAUSE ANY EROSION OF PUBLIC TRUST IN OUR ELECTORAL PROCESS COULD DOOM THE GREAT EXPERIMENT.

HERE ON THE ISSUE ARE REPUBLICAN REPRESENTATIVE TIMOTHY WESCO OF OSCEOLA AND THE AUTHOR OR SPONSOR OF SEVERAL ELECTION MEASURES MAKING HEADLINES THIS SESSION.

FLOOR LIEDER AND A MEMBER OF THE ELECTIONS AND APPORTIONMENT COMMITTEE.

BRAD KING, CODIRECTOR OF THE BIPARTISAN INDIANA ELECTION DIVISION AND A FORMER COUNCIL TO THE INDIANA HOUSE AND SENATE ELECTION COMMITTEES AND JULIA VAUGHN OF COMMON CAUSE INDIANA A IN AN PARTISAN ORGANIZATION DEDICATED TO PROMOTING ETHICAL AND ACCOUNTABLE GOVERNMENT.

THANK YOU FOR COMING AND RENTING YOUR EXPERIENCE TO THIS DISCUSSION.

I WANT TO SETTLE THE STAGE SO OUR VIEWERS AND LISTENERS CAN SEE WHERE EVERYBODY IS COMING FROM.

I'LL GO AROUND AND SAY GIVE ME A GRADE ON THE CURRENT STATE OF THE ELECTORAL PROCESS IN TERMS OF THE INTEGRITY AND SECURITY AND WAS THE 2020 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION LEGITIMATE ELECTION, WAS JOE BIDEN DULY ELECTED?

AGAIN THAT SETTLES THE STAGE FOR A LOT OF ELECTION DISCUSSIONS THESE CASE.

>> INDIANA HAS LED THE NATION IN BOTH VOTER ACCESS AND ELECTION SECURITY.

END I WOULD GIVE OUR STATE AN A FOR OUR ELECTIONS AND PRESIDENT BIDEN WAS CERTIFIED BY IS SUFFICIENT NUMBERS OF SECRETARIES OF STATE TO BE DULY ELECTED PRESIDENT.

>>> PRIOR, SAME QUESTIONS.

>> SO I CERTAINLY THINK THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN IS DULY ELECTED AND HOPEFULLY EVERYONE CAN COME TO AN AGREEMENT WITH THAT, THE VOTERS SPOKE AND HE'S IN THE WHITE HOUSE NOW.

AS FAR AS A LETTER GRADE, I THINK IT'S PERSPECTIVE THAT YOU HAVE, IF WE LOOK AT THE LAWS THAT WE'VE PASSED TO -- THAT WOULD MAKE IT MORE DIFFERENT FOR PEOPLE TO VOTE I WOULDN'T GIVE US A HIGH GRADE BUT I DO THINK THAT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE LENGTH OF TIME IT TAKES FOR OUR RETURNS TO COME IN THE NIGHT OF THEL I WOULD GIVE THAT AN A BUT OVERALL PROBABLY BETWEEN A B OR C. >> BRAD KING YOU SPENT YEARS WORKING IN ELECTIONS WITHIN THE DIVISION AND IN VARIOUS ROLES IN AND AROUND -- GIVE ME YOUR TAKE ON THE SAME TWO QUESTIONS.

>> I THINK INDIANA HAS DEMONSTRATED IT'S AN INTERNATIONAL LEADER SO I WOULD GIVE US AN A.

THERE'S ALWAYS ROOM FOR IMPROVEMENT BUT INDIANA WAS THE FIRST TO IMPLEMENT VOTE CENTERS WHICH ALLOWS VOTERS TO VOTE ANYWHERE THAT'S CONVENIENT IN THEIR COUNTY AND INDIANA EXPANDED THE PERIOD FOR ABSENTEE APPLICATIONS TO BE ALMOST A YEAR, SO SOMEONE CAN APPLY TO VOTE ABSENTEE IN 2024 BEGINNING IN DECEMBER OF 2023.

SO WE'VE LET THE NATION IN HAVING SOME REFORMS THAT EXPAND ACCESS FOR VOTERS.

THE SECOND QUESTION IS WE'RE A FACILITATION -- NATION GOVERNORRED BY LAW AND JOE BIDEN IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.

>> I WOULD GIVE US AN A FOR INTEGRITY AND I WOULD GIVE US AN F FOR ACCESS.

WE HAVE RANKED RANKED IN IF BOLTED THE BOTTOM THIRD IN TERMS OF TURNOUT SO THAT IS TELLING.

IT IS MORE DIFFICULT THE VOTE HERE IN INDIANA THAN IT IS IN MOST OTHER STATES.

AND IN TERMS OF THE LEGITIMATED CITY OF THE 2020 ELECTION JOE BIDEN WON AND WE NEED THE ELECTION DENIERS TO ACCEPT THAT.

>>> NOW EVERYBODY KNOWS THE CARTS ARE TON TABLE AND I'M TAKEN WITH YOUR VARIOUS ANSWERS WHERE WE HAVE REPRESENTATIVE WESCO YOU GIVE THE STATE AN A, REPRESENTATIVE PRIOR YOU GAVE IT LEE LOWER MARKS AND YET REPRESENTATIVE WESCO YOU'RE THE ONE WHO IS ADVOCATING NEW RESTRICTIONS AND REFORMS.

IF IT'S AN A SHOULDN'T SHE BE THE ONE THAT'S CALLING FOR REFORMS?

WALK US THROUGH WHY REFORMS ARE NEEDED AND WHAT YOUR -- LET'S START WITH HOUSE BILL 1334 WHICH WAS HEART IN THE SENATE THIS WEEK.

>> ANSWER DEMANDING ESPECIALLY AS TECHNOLOGY CHANGES, AS THE PROCESS CHANGES AND INDIANA'S BEEN A LEADER NOT JUST IN VOTER ID BUT ALSO IN INCREASING ACCESS THROUGH VOTE CENTERS AND ALLOWING PEOPLE TO VOTE ANYWHERE IN THEIR COUNTY OR TO VOTE EARLY IN PERSON.

ONE OF THE LONGEST PERIODS IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY AT 28 DAYS.

BUT AS WE MOVE FORWARD THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT'S STATIC, WE ALWAYS WANT TO STRIVE TO BE TO BEST WE CAN BE SO THAT'S WHY I'M INTERESTED IN MANGING SURE THAT WE HAVE THE STRONGEST LAWS POSSIBLE SO PEOPLE CAN HAVE THE GREATEST CONFIDENCE THAT INDIANA IS DOING ALL WE CAN TO MAKE SURE OUR ELECTIONS ARE SAFE AND SECURE AND ACCESSIBLE.

>>> SO FOR INSTANCE YOUR MOTIVATION FOR AUTHORING HOUSE BILL 1334 IS NOT A COUNTER TO WHO YOU PERCEIVE TO BE FRAUD RAMPANT BUT RATHER PREEMPTIVE.

>> PREEMPTIVE AND THERE ARE CASES OF FRAUD EVERY CYCLE.

NOT OVERWHELMING BUT ESPECIALLY IN RELATIONSHIP TO ABSENTEE BALLOTS, THERE'S A SAMPLING AND PEOPLE HAVE LONG QUESTIONED THE LEGITIMACY AND OFTEN TIMES HERE WE HAVE A HISTORY OF FORGED SIGNATURES AND A HISTORY OF ABSENTEE BALLOTS BEING A DETERMINING PARENT IN CLOSE ELECTIONS SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO ENSURE PEOPLE THESE BALLOTS ARE BEING COMPLETED BY THOSE WHO CLAIM TO COMMITTEE THEM AND FILL THEM OUT.

>> OF COURSE IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN MOST OF THE INSTANCES WERE ABOUT ACCESS -- WHICH IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT FROM -- >> IT'S A LOT DIFFERENT, JOHN.

IN HOUSE BILL 1334 WOULDN'T DO ANYTHING TO ADDRESS THOSE PROBLEMS THAT HAVE HAPPENED IN ST. JOE COUNTY.

>> THAT'S TO GET PEOPLE ON THE BALLOT.

>> THE PROBLEM WITH 1334 IS IT OVEREMPHASIZES THE CONCERN ABOUT INTEGRITY AT THE DETRIMENT OF EASY ACCESS TO MAIL IN BALLOTS FOR VOTERS.

IT INSERTS ANOTHER STEP, ANOTHER REQUEST FOR INFORMATION AND MANY PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE TRIPPED UP BY THAT REQUEST, SO THERE'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER STEP IN THE PROCESS FOR COUNTY CLOSURES AS THEY TRY TO ADMINISTER THE ABSENTEE BALLOT APPLICATIONS SO IT'S GOING TO PUT ANOTHER HURT IN PLACE FOR INDIANA VOTER AND IN PARTICULAR FOR OUR MOST VULNERABLE VOTERS TEMPERATURE INDIANA ALREADY HAS ONE OF THE MOST RESTRICTIVE VOTE BY MAIL STATUTES IN THE COUNTRY AND SO OVERWHELMINGLY THE PEOPLE WHO CHOOSE THAT OPTION ARE ELDERLY OR DISABLED, AGAIN THE HE'S ABLE TO JUMP OVER THE HURDLES.

>>> LET'S EXAMINE THAT, THE REASON YOU'RE SAY IT'S THE MOST RESTRICTIVE IN MOST STATES YOU BE HAVE A MAIL IN BALLOTS, HERE UNLESS YOU'RE 65 OR OVER WHICH IS SPARED LITIGATION ON ANOTHER THOUGHT, WE COULD SPEND PART OF THE SHOW JUST TALKING ABOUT THAT ISSUE AND DIFFERENTIATION OF AGE, BUT NOW YOU HAVE TO GIVE AN EXCUSE, YOU HAVE TO SAY I'M GOING TO BE OUT OF TOWN, I'M DISABLED.

DO YOU THINK BRAD THAT -- WHERE DO YOU PUT US IN TERMS OF HOW STRINGENT THE EVER -- IS THERE AN ONUS ON THE NEEDY?

>> NO, JOHN I DON'T THINK THERE'S AN ONEROUS BURDEN ON VOTERS WITH REGARD TO THE ACCESS TO ABSENTEE BALLOT.

I DON'T THINK WE CAN PUT TOO MUCH EMPHASIS ON INTEGRITY BUZZ IT'S TIED TO VOTER CONFIDENCE IN THAT THE WINNER OF THE ELECTION IS DULY SERVING IN THAT OFFICE.

WHAT WE'VE HAD A IS DEVELOPMENT WHERE THE NORM WHERE MOST VOTERS IN INDIANA VEHICLE VOTE ON ELECTION DAY AT THE POLLS IS STILL TRUE, ROUGHLY 2-3S DID LAST NOVEMBER BUT IT'S A BIG INCREASE IN THE NUMBER OF ABSENTEE VOTING FROM WHEN INDIANA INSTITUTED PHOTO ID LAWS IN 2005.

THE NEXT ELECTION TEN PERCENT OF THE BALLOTS WERE VOTED BY ABSENTEE, AND NEXT ELECTION THAT TRIPLED TO 36 PERCENT SO WE'RE SEEING A DIFFERENT METHOD BEING USED IN THE THE ELECTION PROCESS THAT RAISES -- >> MORE PEOPLE VOTING AND MORE OPPORTUNITIES.

>> IT IS INHERENTLY SOMETHING WHERE HE WANT TO TAKE SAFEGUARDS BECAUSE ONE OF OUR BEDROCK PRINCIPLES IS WE WANT BALLOTS TO BE UNDER BIPARTISAN CUSTODY AND WENT WE ENTRUST AN ABSENTEE BALLOT TO THE MAIL WE DON'T HAVE THAT CHAIN OF CUSTODY THAT WE HAVE IN OTHER SITUATIONS WHEN THERE'S BIPARTISAN OVERSIGHT TO MAKE SURE THE LAWS ARE BEING FOLLOWED.

>> JUMP?

AND THEN I'M GOING TO TRY TO REMEMBER TO FOLLOW UP TO THAT.

>> I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO KEEP IN MIND THAT IN 2020 WHEN WE HAD A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF PEOPLE VOTING ABSENTEE BECAUSE OF COVID WE DIDN'T HAVE ANY ISSUES OF VOTER FRAUD.

>> THERE WERE SOME.

>> BUT VERY FEW, ABSENTEE BALLOTS I SHOULD SAY SO WE DID NOT HAVE THAT ISSUE, SO I THINK WE ARE CREATING A BILL TO SOLVE A PROBLEM REALLY THAT DOESN'T EXIST.

THE BIGGEST ISSUE THAT I SEE AS FAR AS PEOPLE SAYING -- HAVING A CONCERN WITH VOTER INTEGRITY IS THE PERSON I WANTED TO WIN DIDN'T WIN SO I DON'T LIKE THE OUTCOME SO THERE MUST BE SOMETHING WRONG WITH THE SYSTEM, AND I THINK WHEN A PERSON IS DULY ELECTED WHETHER YOU LIKE THAT PERSON OR NOT YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT THAT OUTCOME, BECAUSE THAT IS A TRUE THREAT TO OUR DEMOCRACY.

WHEN PEOPLE DON'T BELIEVE A PERSON IS ELECTED SIMPLY BECAUSE IT'S THE PERSON I DON'T WANT AND I THINK THAT IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO DEMOCRACY WHEN YOU DENY THAT A PERSON THAT HAS BEEN DULY ELECTED -- >> THAT A LEGITIMATES ASSESSMENT?

>> HOUSE BILL 1334 IS A BILL THAT TAKES INDIANA'S VOTER ID LAW WHICH HISTORICALLY ANY DEMOCRATIC COLLEAGUES OPPOSE VOTER ID LAWS 20 YEARS, GOING ALL THE WAY TO THE SUPREME COURT AND TAKING THAT STANDARD THAT WE HAVE FOR IN PERSON VOTING EITHER BY ABSENTEE OR IN PERSON VOTING ON ELECTION DAY AND CITYING LET'S HAVE A UNIFORM STANDARD NON-ND NO, NO MATTER HOW YOU VOTE YOU SHOULD HAVE A STANDARD ID.

>> YOU CAN PROVIDE THE LAST FOUR DIGITS OF YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY, THIS WOULD REQUIRE THAT OR -- >> OR A COPY OF YOUR.

>> TRIBAL ISSUED ID -- >> IT'S NOT ALL OF THE ABOVE, IT'S PROVIDE WHICHEVER IS MOST CONVENIENT TO YOU AND WE'LL MATCH THAT WITH VOTER REGISTRATION.

>> DOES IT HAVE TO MATCH -- NOT HERE BUT THERE HAVE BEEN CONTROVERSIES IN OTHER STATES WHERE THERE'S A GOTCHA BECAUSE IF YOU PROVIDED ONE FORM OF IDENTIFICATION WHEN YOU RECOMMEND BUT THEN CAME BACK TEN YEARS LATER AND SAID I DON'T REMEMBER IF I DID ANY DRIVER'S LICENSE OR -- >> WE'RE NOT IN ANY -- IT'S WAY WANTING TO REJECT ABSENTEE BALLOT APPLICATIONS SO THE BILL OUTLINES PROCEDURES TO TAKE TO CONTACT THE VOTER AND INFORM THEM THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE A MATCH AND ALLOW THEM TO RESUBMIT AN APPLICATION TO GET THE BALLOT, AND AS BRAD MENTIONED WE HAVE AN ENORMOUS PERIOD OF TIME THAT YOU CAN BEGIN THAT PROCESS APPLYING FOR AN ABSENTEE BALLOT.

THE OBJECTIVE IS NOT TO DIMINISH ABSENTEE BALLOT, IT'S SIMPLY TO ENSURE THE PERSON CASTING THE BALLOT IS THE PERSON THEY SAY THEY ARE.

>> BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT THIS ALL HAPPENS -- MOST PEOPLE DON'T SUBMITTAL THEIR APPLICATION FOR AN ABSENTEE BALLOT MONTHS BEFORE THE ELECTION, THEY DO IT A FEW WEEKS, AND THE CLOCK STARTS TICKING SO OUR CONCERN IS, FOR EXAMPLE, THE STATE HAS NO NUMBER ON FILE FOR ME.

I'VE NEVER GIVEN THEM MY DRIVER'S LICENSE NUMBER SO THEY ASSIGN ME A NUMBER SO ANY NUMBER I SUBMIT IS NOT GOING TO MATCH, AUTOMATICALLY KICKING IT OUT.

YES OR NO IT SO I WOULD HAVE TO CALL AND THE COUNTY CLERK TO FIND OUT WHAT ANY NUMBER IS BEFORE I CAN COMPLETE THE APPLICATION, SO AGAIN ANOTHER HURDLE AND ALL THIS HAPPENS IN A VERY TRUNCATED PERIOD OF TIME SO PEOPLE WILL BE DISENFRANCHISESSED BECAUSE THE CLACK RAN OUT.

>> SO YOU WOULD BE NAVIGATING THE -- >> I WILL DO IT BUT A SENIOR CITIZEN?

IT'S GOING TO BE MUCH MORE DIFFICULT FOR THEM.

>> SENIOR CITIZENS, PEOPLE WHO ARE DISABLED AND PEOPLE IN MILITARY WHO ARE OVERSEAS, IF THEY SUBMIT THEIR APPLICATION AND DON'T HAVE THE INVESTIGATION, CRUNCH TIME HOW ARE THEY GOING TO BE ABLE TO VOTE?

AGAIN WE'RE TRYING TO SOLVE A PROBLEM THAT DOESN'T EXIST.

WHAT WE SHOULD BE FOCUSED ON SO HOW DO WE INCREASE THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT COME OUT AND VOTE.

WE HAVE SOME OF THE LOWEST PARTICIPATION FOR PEOPLE WHO COME TO THE POLLS AND VOTE.

HOW DO WE INCREASE THOSE NUMBERS?

THAT'S WHAT WE SHOULD BE FOCUSED ON, NOT PUTTING RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE GOING TO ADDITION ENFRANCHISE PEOPLE.

SO IT'S GOING TO BE DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE THE FIGURE OUT IF THEY HAVE A NUMBER, WHAT IS THAT NUMBER, TRYING TO CALL IN THE CLERK'S OFFICER AND GET THAT INFORMATION.

>> 99 PERCENT OF PEOPLE IT'S A DRIVER'S LICENSE NUMBER OR LAST FOUR OF THEIR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER SO THERE'S ONE PERCENT THAT HAVE IN THIS UNIQUE IDENTIFYING NUMBER AND I'VE TALKED TO SENIORS AND THIS IS NOT AN OBSTACLE FOR THEM.

THAT DIDN'T TURN OUT TO BE THE CASE AT ALL SO THESE ARE THE SAME ARGUMENTS THERE.

I DON'T SEE THIS AS AN OBSTACLE TO SENIORS TO VOTE CAN THIS IS JUST A A ASSURING THEM THE VOTES THAT ARE BEING CAST HAVE COMING FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE WHO THEY SAY THEY ARE.

>> THE OTHER THING PEOPLE CAN DO IS PHOTO COPY, AND THAT RAISES THE ISSUE WHERE EASY ACCESS TO -- >> WHICH IS WHY WE PROVIDE THAT OPTION PROVIDE A PHOTO COPY OF YOUR PHOTO IDENTIFICATION.

>> HAS TO BE DONE IN PERSON OR THROUGH AN -- >> THE APPLICATION IS SUBMITTED BY MAIL.

>> NOT ONLINE -- >> THERE IS AN ONLINE PROCESS, THAT ALREADY REQUIRES THAT YOU SUBMIT YOUR DRIVER'S LICENSE NUMBER SO IT'S AGAIN MAKING THAT STANDARD UNIFORM.

>> WHAT ABOUT THIS ONE PERCENT?

TIM WESCO SUGGESTS -- >> I HAVE TO CHALLENGE THAT NUMBER -- BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THAT'S ACCURATE.

>> I BELIEVE IT IS ESSENTIALLY ACCURATE.

>> THEORETICALLY IF ANY OF THESE PEOPLE -- PRESENTS A LEGITIMATE HURDLE THAT HAS TO BE OVERCOME.

>> I DON'T THINK IT'S A SIGNIFICANT HURDLE.

WHEN CHIEF JUSTICE JOHN ROBERTS WAS ENGAGED IN ORAL ARGUMENT ON INDIANA'S PHOTO ID LAW HE SAID I'M FROM INDIANA, I KNOW HOW FAR IT TAKE TO GET TO THE COUNTY SEAT TO PRODUCE AN ID, THIS IS NOT AN ONEROUS BURDEN AND I THINK HE'S EXACTLY RIGHT.

THERE ARE SOME EXPENDITURE OF TIME AND EFFORT THAT EVERY VOTER HAS TO MAKE IT BUT IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY RISE TO THE LEVEL OF BEING ONEROUS OR UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

>>> WHAT CONCERNS YOU MORE, THE NOTION OF THE CHECKING OF THE PAPERWORK, THE NUMBER COMPARISONs OR ANOTHER ASPECT OF THE LEGISLATION WHICH WOULD PREVENT ANY GOVERNMENT AGENCY FROM ESSENTIALLY DOING AN UNSOLICITED MASS MAILING FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM.

THERE ARE SOME SECRETARY OF STATES THAT JUST SORT OF THAT'S STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURE, THEY GO OUT AND WHETHER YOU ASK FOR IT OR NOT AND THAT WOULD BE -- WHAT PART OF THIS SEEMS TO BE MORE TROUBLING TO YOU?

>> I CAN'T SAY THAT ONE IS MORE TROUBLING THAN THE OTHER.

I JUST THINK THE BILL OVERALL IS TROUBLING, SO I THINK THEY ARE ALL EQUAL WEIGHTED BECAUSE THEY CREATE ADDITIONAL HURDLES FOR PEOPLE TO TRY TO VOTE OR GET ACCESS TO THE BALLOT TO VOTE AND THAT CONCERNS ME.

AND I THINK THAT SHOULD CONCERN ALL OF US.

AGAIN WHEN WE HAVE VERY LOW NUMBERS OF TURNOUT IF WE CAN BE CREATIVE IN MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE GET THE BALLOTS AND THEY'RE ABLE TO VOTE WHETHER IT'S ABSENTEE OR ON THE DAY OF ELECTION, THOSE ARE STEPS THAT WE NEED TO BE TAKING.

WE SHOULD NOT BE HAPPY THAT WE'RE AT THE BOTTOM WHEN WE LOOK AT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE PARTICIPATING IN THE DEMOCRATIC PROCESS.

>>> WE HAD A RECORD YEAR -- >> A RECORD YEAR -- WE SHOULD BE HIGHER.

>> WHICH BRINGS UP THE POINT THE TURNOUT IS A MEASURE BUT NOT THE NECESSARILY THE BEST MEASURE OF ACCESS TO THE ELECTION PROCESS.

WHAT DRIVES TURNOUT IS WHEN THERE'S ENTHUSIASM EITHER FOR OR AGAINST A PARTICULAR CANDIDATE OR A PARTICULAR ISSUE, SUCH A REFERENDUM TO RAISE TAXES TO FUND A GOVERNMENT PROJECT.

THOSE ARE THE SORT OF THINGS THAT MOTIVATE INDIVIDUALS TO TAKE TIME TO EXERCISE THEIR RIGHT TO VOTE.

IT'S EASY FOR US WHO ARE IMMERSED IN THE ELECTION AND POLITICAL PROCESS TO NOT APPRECIATE THAT VOTERS HAVE A LARGE NUMBER OF PERSONAL AND FAMILY RESPONSIBILITIES AND THEY HAVE TO TAKE TIME TO MAKE IT A PRIORITY TO CAST THEIR VOTE AND THEY MAY NOT BE MOTIVATE IN A PARTICULAR ELECTION WHEN THERE'S NOT A CANDIDATE OR ISSUE THAT GALVANIZES THEM TO VOTE.

>> VOTER TURNOUT IS AN INTERESTING QUESTION BECAUSE THERE ARE A LOT OF FACTORS THAT DRIVE TURNOUT.

TURNOUT IS GENERALLY LOWER THAN OTHER DISTRICTS AROUND THE STATE AND ONE OF THE REASONS FOR THAT IS I HAVE A HIGH PERCENTAGE OF AMISH POPULATION AND THEY DON'T BELIEVE IN VOTING.

AND IN OTHER RESPECTS WHEN PEOPLE GET UPSET THEY SHOW UP TO VOTE AND WHEN THEY'RE NOT UPSET AND THEY'RE HAPPY WITH HOW THINGS ARE GOING SOMETIMES THAT IMPACTS HOW MUCH PEOPLE ARE MOTIVATED TO GET OUT AND VOTE, SO ACCESS IS -- I DON'T THINK IT'S AN ACCESS ISSUE, THERE'S CULTURAL THINGS AND I WANT MORE PEOPLE TO VOTE AND WANT MORE PEOPLE TO GET OUT THERE AND BE ENGAGED IN THE PROCESS AND THE ISSUE, BUT I DON'T KNOW IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH ACCESS.

WE HAVE 28 DAYS OF EARLY VOTING IN PERSON, YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO VOTE BY MAIL IF YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE IN TOWN OR NOT ABLE THE GET TO THE POLLING POLICE STATION ON ELECTION DAY SO I DON'T THINK THERE'S A DIRECT CORRELATION.

>> LET ME AGREE WITH REPRESENTATIVE WESCO AND BRAD FOR ONCE AND THAT IS IT'S COMPLICATED.

TURNOUT IS DEFINITELY COMPLICATED AND THE LAB OF COMPETITION, YOU TALK ABOUT INTEREST, THAT'S DIRECTLY RELATED TO GERMAN DEEING IN OUR SEDATE AND THE LACK OF COMPETITION.

>> THERE'S NO COMPETITION.

>> THERE'S NO COMPETITION IN OUR CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION, THERE'S VERY LITTLE COMPETITION IN THE STATE LEGISLATURE, BUT.

>> MAYBE THAT'S THE ART OF THE MAP.

>> THE ABILITY TO HAVE A STREAMLINED PROCESS TO GET YOUR VOTE BY MAIL, THE ABILITY TO NOT HAVE TO FILL OUT A LOT OF INFORMATION, THOSE ARE THINGS -- SURE ONE OR TWO OF THOSE ISN'T A BIG OBSTACLE BUT WHEN YOU STACK SEVERAL IT DOES BECOME AN OBSTACLE.

THE PROBLEM IS THE INDIANA GENERAL ASSEMBLY IS ONLY GOING ONE WAY AND THAT IS TO MAKE VOTING MORE RESTRICTIVE.

WE SHOULD HAVE THE MOST INCLUSIVE ELECTION PROCESS IN THE COUNTRY AND WE'RE MOVING AWAY FROM THAT.

>> IF YOU GET THIS BILL ENACTED IS THAT GOING TO BE IT FOR A WHILE?

OR IS SOMETHING ELSE LURKING, A NEXT STEP TO ENSURE THE -- >> IT'S IMPORTANT TO CREATE STABILITY ESPECIALLY AS WE COME INTO A BLOCKBUSTER ELECTION YEAR NEXT AREA BUT THERE WILL ALWAYS BE ISSUES AND QUESTIONS THAT COME UP AND I EVER PLEASED TO WORK WITH BRAD THIS YEAR ON HOUSE BILL 1336 AND WE PASSED THAT BILL WITH A LOT OF CHANGES AND PASSED THAT UNANIMOUSLY OUT OF THE COMMITTEE AND HOUSE SO THERE'S ALWAYS CHANGES AND KEEPING UP -- THE CODE UP-TO-DATE AND AS WORKABLE AS POSSIBLE.

>> THAT'S WHY WE HAVE THESE SHOWS TO CUT THROUGH THE CONFUSION PEOPLE HAVE AND GET THE THOUGHTS AND FACTS OUT THERE.

AND THE BLOCKBUSTER ELECTION NEXT YEAR WE SHOULD SEE A PRETTY GOOD TURNOUT.

THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE.

AGAIN MY GUESTS HAVE BEEN TIMOTHY WESCO OF OSCEOLA, DEMOCRATIC REPRESENTATIVE PRIOR, BRAD KING, CODIRECTOR OF THE INDIANA ELECTION DIVISION AND JULIA VAUGHN WITH COMMON CAUSE.

TIME NOW FOR OUR WEEKLY CONVERSATION WITH ED FEIGENBAUM AND ED WE COVERED ALLOTS IN THE ROUND TABLE.

WHAT DIDN'T WE COVER?

>> I THINK YOU WANT TO TAKE A STEP BACK AND LOOK AT THE WAY 1334 STARTED ANDTY THINK THAT GIVES A CLUE WITH WHAT THEY WANTED TO DO WITH THE BILL AND THE ORIGINAL BILL AT THE VERY TOP -- >> HE BEING TIM WESCO.

>> REPRESENTATIVE WESCO RIGHT, WOULD HAVE RESTRICTED SOMEBODY FROM GET MING AN ABSENTEE ABOUT WHAT TIME IF THEY COULD NOT ATTEST TO THE FACT THEY WOULD NOT BE AROUND IN THE PERIOD OR ON ELECTION DAY SO IT WOULD HAVE BEEN REALLY RESTRICTIVE.

THE OF COURSE THAT GIVES YOU A GOOD LOOK AS TO WHY WE HAVE THAT COMMITTEE SYSTEM, BIPARTISAN LEGISLATURE BUT THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL INTENT OF THE BILL -- >> EARMARKS ON A BALLOT OR MULTIPLE APPLICATIONS SENT TO THE SAME HOUSEHOLD.

>> THE LITTLE THINGS, THE HIGHLIGHTER, THOSE ARE LITTLE TECHNICAL THINGS THAT TRIP UP PEOPLE IN VOTING AND IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT NECESSARILY.

WE TALK ABOUT THE BIPARTISAN NATURE OF THE ELECTORAL SYSTEM WE ASPIRE TO BUT AT THE SAME TIME WHEN YOU DO THINGS LIKE REQUIRE A SIGNATURE FROM A DEMOCRATIC THE POLL WORKER AND A REPUBLICAN POLL WORKER AND A BOARD MEMBER ON A BALLOT FOR EXAMPLE THEN YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR SOMEBODY TO FORGET TO PUT THE SIGNATURE ON OR THE SIGNATURE BECOMES MESSED UP AND THE BALLOT DOESN'T GET COUNTED AND WHERE ARE YOU THEN?

>> WHERE DO YOU THINK THIS GOES?

DO WE SEE MORE AND MARCH RESTRICTIONS OR THE BRANDON CENTER WAS SAYING DOZENS OF STATES HAVE DONE THE OPPOSITE, MADE IT EASIER TO VOTE.

AT WHAT POINT -- I KNOW WE'RE NOT PURSUING AS MUCH LEGISLATION AS WE DID A YEAR OR TWO AGO.

>> I DON'T KNOW IF THE PENDULUM IS GOING TO SWING BUT WE'VE MOVED TO A MUCH MORE LIBERAL SYSTEM AND IT WORKED.

>>> ALL RIGHT.

ED VERY GOOD, ALWAYS APPRECIATE YOUR INSIGHT.

>>> LIKE MANY OTHER STATES INDIANA IS DEALING WITH A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS.

WHAT CAN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY DO TO EASE THE PAIN?

ON THE NEXT INDIANA LAWMAKERS.

I'M JON SCHWANTES AND ON BEHALF OF COMMENTATOR ED FEIGENBAUM, WFYI PUBLIC MEDIA AND INDIANA'S OTHERS PUBLIC BROADCASTING STATIONINGS I THANK YOU FOR JOINING US AND I INVITE YOU TO VISIT WFYI.ORG FOR MORE STATEHOUSE NEWS.

UNTIL NEXT WEEK,